Author Topic: New Tool TDIE (WIP)  (Read 6111 times)

Offline Starforce2

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #20 on: June 13, 2009, 01:38:25 PM »
I notice some of the arcs (the images of them on the right side) don't look as clean as mark allens TDE. That coulse use some cleaning up.

Also, have you solved the issue of all engine property's defaulting to impulse iocns when the hp loads? Always a bug with the original. SO far as I know they show up as warp engine icons ingame, though I've not bothered to look in a long time. It was only the editor display that was the problem.
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Offline Mario

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #21 on: June 13, 2009, 07:35:04 PM »
Quote
I notice some of the arcs (the images of them on the right side) don't look as clean as mark allens TDE. That coulse use some cleaning up.

I'm a programmer who wishes to be any good with Photoshop, but I am not :(

So I depend on others to do that.

Quote
Also, have you solved the issue of all engine property's defaulting to impulse iocns when the hp loads? Always a bug with the original. SO far as I know they show up as warp engine icons ingame, though I've not bothered to look in a long time. It was only the editor display that was the problem.

Yes, check the attachment.
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Offline Starforce2

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #22 on: June 13, 2009, 11:59:36 PM »
nice
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Offline Starforce2

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #23 on: June 17, 2009, 12:54:09 AM »
one more question. Can arc indicators have some type of calibration so when ever you place the green charge indicator the clear charge arc automaticly centers with it?
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Offline teleguy

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #24 on: June 17, 2009, 08:58:21 AM »
one more question. Can arc indicators have some type of calibration so when ever you place the green charge indicator the clear charge arc automaticly centers with it?
That's what icon linking does.

BTW check out the beta version at BCS.

Offline Starforce2

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #25 on: June 17, 2009, 03:19:43 PM »
Ok, I thought tjat the linking was for like tmp where you have an A and B part to each bank and you can put them in the same spot with one step.

Can the beta be put on bcfiles?
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Offline Mario

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #26 on: June 17, 2009, 07:01:44 PM »
Check your PM, you will find the latest version which can go to bcf.
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Offline Phaser

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #27 on: June 17, 2009, 09:30:56 PM »
one more question. Can arc indicators have some type of calibration so when ever you place the green charge indicator the clear charge arc automaticly centers with it?
That's what icon linking does.
Nice!  That's something that always annoyed me.

Offline Starforce2

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #28 on: June 17, 2009, 11:38:02 PM »
I will use this on my next hp to give it a whirl. Another thing I want to know of...does your TDE ignore systems that are not applied/acitve in the HP? I'm refering to only those systems read by the game, declaired in the list, not phasers or something that may have been deleted and not removed from the hp if you fallow me...
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Offline Mario

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #29 on: June 18, 2009, 11:28:27 AM »
For Arc Placements it ignores Tractor Beams although they also have same attributes regarding placements found in Phasers i.e.

For Damage Placements it ignores all systems which do not have SetPosition2D attribute.

Systems ignored are just kept in memory and when requested the info is resaved into a new hardpoint structure with the new attributes which were set in the TDIE.

Is there something else which I should ignore regarding Damage Placements, some systems even though they have SetPosition2D attribute?
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Offline teleguy

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #30 on: June 18, 2009, 11:56:50 AM »
Quote
Is there something else which I should ignore regarding Damage Placements, some systems even though they have SetPosition2D attribute?
Untargetable systems like engineering or the impulse engine system.

Offline Starforce2

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #31 on: June 18, 2009, 12:08:42 PM »
What I was refering to is say you have an HP with 10 phasers. The ship you are doing has 8. So you remove 2 of them. The 2 you remove are still in the hardpoint, but are not declaired in those sets of lines for each property at the bottom (so when the game loads it loads 8 phasers). The old TDE would load all 10, so in oder to get rid of them you'd hafta go into the tempate section of the mpe and delete the 2 again to actualy remove the data from the py file. This applies to all other systems as well. Now, I myself delete unused systems at the end of an hp but sometimes you forget one or some people don't so then they get in the way (you know there will be a bunch of these in the km refebishing going on)
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Offline Mario

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #32 on: June 18, 2009, 12:41:54 PM »
Quote
Untargetable systems like engineering or the impulse engine system.

That should be ignored?

These properties still get displayed on the Damage Indicators, at least I was told that. I am not an HPer, but I am pretty sure in that.

Quote
What I was refering to is say you have an HP with 10 phasers. The ship you are doing has 8. So you remove 2 of them. The 2 you remove are still in the hardpoint, but are not declaired in those sets of lines for each property at the bottom (so when the game loads it loads 8 phasers). The old TDE would load all 10, so in oder to get rid of them you'd hafta go into the tempate section of the mpe and delete the 2 again to actualy remove the data from the py file. This applies to all other systems as well. Now, I myself delete unused systems at the end of an hp but sometimes you forget one or some people don't so then they get in the way (you know there will be a bunch of these in the km refebishing going on)

TDIE uses the same library which I developed for HP Tweaker in BCUT. This lib loads all properties, checks which systems are actually used in game. Those that are not used in game are marked as non editable properties. In memory TDIE ignores them and doesn't list out. When you resave the new HP, the non editable properties are resaved just as the systems which are used in the game. So you get the same HP structure minus the parts which were edited which are the new coordinates. So, the answer is Yes.
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Offline NeoKaede

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #33 on: June 18, 2009, 01:20:44 PM »
Quote
Untargetable systems like engineering or the impulse engine system.

That should be ignored?

These properties still get displayed on the Damage Indicators, at least I was told that. I am not an HPer, but I am pretty sure in that.

Yes, they do. Every system is shown in the damage icon, even if it's set as non-targetable.

BTW, every time I used the old TDE, after setting the systems in their correct positions and recompiling the hp, the icons appeared in-game a little to the left from their positions. Will this be corrected? It's my main gripe right now.

Offline Mario

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #34 on: June 18, 2009, 01:51:13 PM »
Quote
BTW, every time I used the old TDE, after setting the systems in their correct positions and recompiling the hp, the icons appeared in-game a little to the left from their positions. Will this be corrected? It's my main gripe right now.

For arcs\indicators I didn't notice any offsets which needed to be adjusted or anything (I could be wrong however). For Damage Icons I did notice that some offsets are required and are applied. How accurate this is, only an HPer can tell me lol

The more feedback is provided, more accurate the program will be. I posted a beta at BCS-TNG. I am willing to listen to input provided.
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Offline Starforce2

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #35 on: June 19, 2009, 01:05:13 AM »
As far as I know, the master systems, like engeneering, or the "phasers" master system for instance are not showed on the icon. I never place them, they are not targetable and none targetable systems cannot be damaged by enemy fire. I tested this by blasting away at the fwd phaser of my original p81 norway HP in which for some reason I accedently set the fwd phaser array to non-targetable. Despite firing numerous shots, obliterating the hull exactly on the spot it fired from, no damage indicator came up, and the system couldn't be destroyed. I've never personally seen a non-targetable system show up as damaged on the p81 connie or reliant, and I've destroyed both in battle. Since I've never touched them from defauly, and my current abbe hp is a modified FCA, then those icons are off to the side lower right corner, and I've never seen icons show there on either my display, or the damage display/target menu when I am destroying the FCA. At the very least, add a filter switch/checkbox to nix systems listed as "non-targetable" if desired.

Is there a way to set a folder path that it automaticly looks in?

*auto-load icon? Ie if I load SFPMontana.py then SFPMontana.tga would automaticly pop up if in the same folder with the py? That could be a handy feature.
 
*It may also be helpfull to make the ship background changeable from white to black. Doing a white tmp vessel on a bright white background is annoying to look at.

*I am messing with the damage right now and the drag is not smooth when holding an icon and moving it around. It's perfectly smooth on the weapon arc display, yet lags to beat hell on dmg.

*the original TDE used a mouse button system for arcs an indicators, where left click selects the charge arc, right click selects the grey arc indicator. That method is more efficient than having to constantly change mode via checkbox below the display. This would result in the nessecity of a dual set of x/y fields needing to be added, obviously, like the old TDE. (icon link makes this somewhat obsolete but sicne the feature needs adjusting, badly in some cases...) One thing that is really annoying is that if I want to place a different indicator on something I can't unless I switch the button. I should only need to click the indicator.

*Fwd and aft indicators are not linking properly (ie missaligned badly)

*Icons revert to original position if you switch to a new property without clicking "apply changes". Throw out this extra step and have the program remember, live, where you've placed and icon. You can save the entire project at any time using the save from the top menu. If you placed an item incorrectly, you simply click and drag it somewhere else, auto-revert isn't nessecary on such a simple process. On the same token, the X,Y position boxes do not update live. Even after "apply changes" they remain at the old values unless you go to another propery and come back.

*Remove the whole mouse click update for weapons arcs. On complex ships, like anything with a dozen or so phasers, eyeballing to simply click and update (similar to the why you place a property in the mpe by clicking and hitting "get position) is more trouble then it's worth. (easier to drag/hover and be done with it) On the damage display it is logical because the damage icon such as a nacelle will be on the nacelle. Click the nacelle, press the button. Again, live update of X/Y as the icon is moved.

*manualy updating of the X/Y has no effect on the damage icon at all. Why is this needed? Multiple torpedo tubes. If I have 4 torpedo tubes on the same side of the ship, I want those little green dots in a nice even line. I am going to want them to all share the same X or Y coordinate, depending if they are a side launch or fwd/aft. Changing this and pressing apply does nothing, the revert back to their old values after I switch properties. Manualy changing this SHOULD have a live effect on the display above.


I reallise this sounds like alot of nagging, but I've HP'd over 300 ships in my time in the BC community, and I can find plenty of reasons to stick with the OLD TDE. In some situations it is easier to use, faster, or allows things to be done yours doesn't. The fact that you don't need to compile or covert icons to BMP, even an improved icon linking wont quite push me to switch. Obviously, however, if you truly wish to make your product superior to the old TDE, I am more than willing to consult on future versions.


Edit: Accedental close saftey block...if change have been made to the display since the last save, a save prompt should appear when attempting to close the program.
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Offline DJ Curtis

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #36 on: June 19, 2009, 11:40:32 AM »
this is long overdue.  kudos.

Offline Mario

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #37 on: June 19, 2009, 01:54:10 PM »
Starforce some of these points are valid and some are not.

I will probably be implementing most of them in the next version, due somewhere next week. And I will want more feedback on it, so I will let you know when a new version is done.

As for thinking of reasons to use the old TDE, Rome was not built in a day. But in the end, everybody will use what ever they prefer regardless of the final look of this tool.
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Offline Starforce2

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #38 on: June 20, 2009, 12:30:22 AM »
I'll be waitin for a new one then!

FYI, if you want better arcs u can get them out of the
Bridge Commander\data\Icons folder
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Offline Starforce2

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Re: New Tool TDIE (WIP)
« Reply #39 on: June 27, 2009, 03:25:19 PM »
bump for news.
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