Author Topic: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises  (Read 3503 times)

Offline Shadowknight1

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Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« on: January 11, 2009, 03:56:11 PM »
One thing I've noticed about people comparing the original 1701 to JJ's is that they always use an angle of the ship similar to the angle JJ's Enterprise is in, but not quite.  However, with BC, it's not difficult to match the angle a little closer, so I did so.  Also for the heck of it, I also put in the 1701-A for more comparison.  Now, JJ's Enterprise, with its visible weapons ports and hull plating, is a bit more akin to the 1701-A, especially with the saucer.  However, the engineering hull of the JJprise has a major difference compared to the other two.  It's height is smaller.  If I got the scaling right here, then it seems to me that the engineering hull is actually a bit longer than on either version of the original Enterprise.  It may seem shorter by the fact that the back-side of the neck on the JJPrise doesn't abruptly stick into the engineering hull but flows further back, giving the neck more substance.  The nacelle pylons have been brought forward and attach to the engines closer to the bussard collectors.  As for the cowlings, those are completely new.  Perhaps they serve some kind of defensive purpose.  Perhaps they're just there to look cool.  Who knows.  It'll be easier to tell when Paramount finally sees fit to give us a full orthographic view of the new/old 1701.  Now, the saucer.  It attaches to the neck of the ship a little further back than the old 1701/refit.  This is one of the things that gives the impression that the engineering hull has been yanked too far forward.  While the engineering hull has been moved forward, it's not that drastic, and neither is the movement of the saucer backwards.  Now the thing that really made me happy when I noticed it is that on the JJPrise, the underside of the saucer doesn't curve upwards before dipping back down for the sensor dome.  While the decision likely bothered some canon-istas, it made me happy.  I never saw any use for the curve except as something to look neat.  All it did was remove a good amount of space from multiple decks on the saucer.

Now, it's still hard to make assumptions about how it all looks when in motion.  After all, the Enterprise-D is one of the clunkiest looking spacecraft on paper, but when she soared across the screen, we all loved it.  And of course, we haven't seen a good aft view of the JJPrise, only a couple of forward shots that tell us that for some reason the engine pylons are curved, bringing the engines closer together, but not dangerously so.  They also look a little more...beefy to me.  But that's just me.  I love the new design and anxiously await the day when Paramount gives us more.  And I hope that this picture will show people what it should.  When people see these, they need to say, "Aren't those the same ship?"

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Offline mckinneyc

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2009, 05:38:11 AM »
Great work and observations Shadow. Looking at your picture the JJ Enterprise seems to fit in more with the refit than the old 60s Enterprise does.

I can't wait to see her on screen. From the couple of shots in the trailer she moves right if you understand where I'm coming from and I think that's important, yeah she looks like the Enterprise but must move like the Enterprise and behave like the Enterprise, after all she is the most important character in the entire film.  :lol:

Offline Shadowknight1

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2009, 01:19:50 PM »
That is one thing I forgot to mention, it's far easier for me to believe that the JJPrise could be refit to the 1701-A-type than the original.  The original and the refit just look way too different. :P

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Offline ChronowerX_GT

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2009, 02:10:51 PM »
Yeah, i know what you mean.

Order of awsomeness :D:
Refit
JJ
TOS


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Offline Shadowknight1

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2009, 01:54:27 PM »
Well, they're all on my list of awesomeness, but the original will always have a special place in my heart.  No redone version, not even Koerner's, can take its place.

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Offline tiqhud

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2009, 02:22:58 PM »
like your first starship, always Special.
TiqHud
you sir, are unable to strike, the port or starboard parts of hull , of a bovine storage facility.
Canon , what people argue exists, that doesn't really  exist.
It is all the little details, that cause headaches.
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Offline Shadowknight1

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2009, 07:00:19 PM »
ACES_HIGH, I am not that guy, and quite frankly his views are the kind that are going to kill Star Trek.  Time travel throws all the rules out the window.  Get over it and enjoy the movie, for the love of Spock.

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Offline Darkthorne

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2009, 01:33:04 PM »
I am just going to judge this film on its own merrits. If its a good story then it will stand on its own. If its not, then its going to flop.
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Offline Darkthunder

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2009, 08:22:03 PM »
I am just going to judge this film on its own merrits. If its a good story then it will stand on its own. If its not, then its going to flop.

Here here. Fed up with all the BS that some things are less canon than others etc. If its a good story, i'll enjoy it. End of post.
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Offline Shadowknight1

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2009, 11:06:45 PM »
Agreed, and I feel the same about the tech.  If it serves its purpose, then its fine by me.  The Enterprise's purpose is to take our crew from point A to point B at very fast speeds and be able to defend against anything bad that may crop up.  This Enterprise, to me, looks like it could easily outrun and outfight the original 1701.

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Offline ChronowerX_GT

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #11 on: January 28, 2009, 09:48:50 AM »
It's too different to compare to TOS. I think this could turn out very well. Look at the new batman or spiderman...


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Offline StarTrekMike

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2009, 07:35:54 PM »
I have always loved the TOS Enterprise very much and the refit has a special place in my heart as the most beautiful thing I have really ever seen (the TMP fly around was amazing).

   With that being said, I really like the new Enterprise...it may be more modern looking and kinda odd at first glance, but I really like the lines and how it seems to have a very graceful organic look to it.

   I know that many will not be happy no matter what they chose...but I think it was a good choice and I am excited to no end to see this movie when it comes out.

   My only problem with it is that the secondary hull looks very small...it is not a big thing but I feel that it should always have a sense of heft to it.

   Mike
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Offline Tuskin38

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #13 on: January 29, 2009, 10:25:27 PM »
It's too different to compare to TOS. I think this could turn out very well. Look at the new batman or spiderman...

There really wasn't a new 'Spiderman' since there was no films before this series. Plus the Movies followed the comics more closely then the new Batman movies. and ones DC and one Marvel.

Offline ChronowerX_GT

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2009, 05:39:00 AM »
It's too different to compare to TOS. I think this could turn out very well. Look at the new batman or spiderman...

There really wasn't a new 'Spiderman' since there was no films before this series. Plus the Movies followed the comics more closely then the new Batman movies. and ones DC and one Marvel.

And??? All I said it was a hell of an improvement over the old ones. So yeah, even if you forget spiderman, the new batman was a lot better than the old batman movies.


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Offline mckinneyc

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2009, 10:25:59 AM »
William Shanter likes the design of the new Enterprise and now I've gotten used to her and saw different angles provided by the various and excellent modders on the site I can't wait to see her in action.

I'm hoping they'll keep the phaser and torpedo sounds of the original.

Offline Shadowknight1

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2009, 12:38:52 PM »
Even if they don't, with Ben Burtt, arguably the father of modern movie sound design, behind the scenes, I'm sure they'll come up with something cool.

As for the secondary hull, it really isn't all that much smaller in length.  In deck usage, maybe.  It's just with everything being drawn so close together, it seems to be too small. :P  Honestly, this ship still looks better than the D.  Just sayin.

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Offline martyr

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2009, 03:12:39 PM »
blasphemy

Offline Shadowknight1

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2009, 07:53:22 PM »
Sorry, I just never cared for the design of the Ent-D.  The huge saucer always seemed out of balance compared to the rest.

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Offline mckinneyc

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Re: Comparing the 1701 Enterprises
« Reply #19 on: January 31, 2009, 08:39:59 AM »
I always think of the 'D' as the ocean liner Enterprise, big, graceful lines and she just keeps ploughing through space.

I'd love to see the final movie of JJs Trek focus on the final mission of the pre-refit 1701, seeing the old gal badly beaten and sorched after, yet again, saving humanity for destruction getting towed into that famous drydock for her refit.