Standardised Weapon Scripts.

[Book]

I'm curious if this is something the modding community (which I'm amazed, and pleased to see is still going fairly strong!) has considered?

It seems like it might help unify all the different ships and stations if everyone was using the same phaser and torpedo types rather than each creating their own.

I've been out of BC modding for awhile so I may be missing a discussion that happened on this.

Thanks!

(I'm sorry if this is the wrong forum, but I don't think it is.)

[King Class Scout]

several packs have been made, but remember, weapon standards change between species, eras, and even ships.  there's almost no such thing as "standardiziation".  also, some people don't like "sharing" when it comes to their custom projectiles, which they feel are just as "copyright" as the ship bodies they design.

[Bones]

yeah but then comes stuff like my Connie refit being unable to stand against TOS Connie

I must admit I love the idea of creating weapons charts for each species, each era like :

    1) Federation 

       - late TNG era

              - Type 9 phaser, damage 400, range 50, max charge/discharge 6/1 (long burst like in series) colors - white\orange\red

              - Type 10 phaser, damage 600, range 60, max charge/discharge 4/1 (shorter burst like in FC) colors - yellow\golden\orange

              - Type 11 phaser, damage 1800, range 70, max charge/discharge 0.5/0.5 (short bursts, quick recharge like in NEM) white\yellow\golden

[Villain]

I'm entirely for this idea. A set of agreed-upon settings for era's and species (As bones said).

Solves most balancing issues instantly.

[Lurok91]

Have to agree too.  The lack of consistency among weapon mods, and species imbalance, has always bugged me.  What I'd really like to see is an agreed list including hull/shields.   No point standardising weapons if shields/hull aren't also.  Many of the ships in KM, and additional downloads,  are way out-of-balance and I think I've spent literally weeks re-balancing them to something I think approaches canon.  

edit: I think CaptainD at Excalibur forums came up with formula for shields/hull something like this...

[tiqhud]

Zambie Zan did make one some time back, never caught on I guess, mainly because even it th TV episodes  they are Not to terribly consistant.

His was pretty good to, another problem, Now, is many ships Already out will need a retrofit yo comply to this standard.

[King Class Scout]

people will just have to simplify and standardize across their own mods.  when you have a LOT of ships in your install(s), and you correct every ONE (like one guy i know IS doing, btw), it takes forever.

[086gf]

Yes, I agree this is absolutely needed for the BC community.

[Book]

yeah but then comes stuff like my Connie refit being unable to stand against TOS Connie

I must admit I love the idea of creating weapons charts for each species, each era like :

    1) Federation  

       - late TNG era

              - Type 9 phaser, damage 400, range 50, max charge/discharge 6/1 (long burst like in series) colors - white\orange\red

              - Type 10 phaser, damage 600, range 60, max charge/discharge 4/1 (shorter burst like in FC) colors - yellow\golden\orange

              - Type 11 phaser, damage 1800, range 70, max charge/discharge 0.5/0.5 (short bursts, quick recharge like in NEM) white\yellow\golden

Yeah, this is exactly what I had in mind, you'd obviously have to distinguish between era and species.

It seems as though, if the community for this game wants to last (which I feel it has the capability to do) standardising balance for mods might be a great step.

[Nebula]

LULZ Lurok91 my new formula for KM is completely reverse to what you showed... speaking of my HP re-balance to KM... I gave out the file to a few people for help and well haven't heard a squawk about it in a while. lol

[JimmyB76]

Zambie Zan did make one some time back

youre thinking of Durandal, and he posted that at BCU years ago...
i think it would be considered outdated by today's standards; i did upload the spreadsheet he made somewhere here at BCC...

[tiqhud]

Opps Yes, jim , durandal,

here is what nebula sent us hobbs and myself

[Morgan]

youre thinking of Durandal, and he posted that at BCU years ago...
i think it would be considered outdated by today's standards; i did upload the spreadsheet he made somewhere here at BCC...

I have it too, Jimmy.  Since it's in keeping with the threads topic I'll upload here so people can find it.

[Starforce2]

problem is there are alot of ships out there..many do not have agreed upon specs in the first place. I balance all mine to galaxy class=1000 phaser damage which was p81's original replacement ship. Sov's are 1200-1400 usualy.
If/when I get around to finishing the tos pack I started it will come with a balance sheet where the standard constitution has 1000 phaser damg and 10000 shield points. ALl other tos ships are a percentage higher or lower. This of course means that you can't battle outside the era but really..the point of taking the tos ent against a cube is what exactly? Or a warbird? One barrage would kill it, if not one shot. We saw evidence for this when the TOS defiant in the NX era when against the NX enterprise and wasted it. The A would do roughly the same and, while there is less difference between the A and B as far as time the C would easily waste either and the D would waste either the A or B in just a few shots, assuming factory specs for each.

[Book]

Right, I'm aware of the massive amount of work it would take. It just seems like at this point (and obviously I might not be the best person to say this considering I'm not really a part of the community anymore) the ships that are going to be made have been made, and its time to work on unifying everything.

[deadthunder2_0]

The reason custom projectiles are made is to make ships unique. Would a Akira class with 14 torpedo tubes firing 2 from each seem balanced if each tube had 900 damage point photon? Not really. My point is for the sake of the game photons and other weapons need to be more customized, however they need to fit into balance sheet.

Also there are many new ships being made for Bridge Commander.

[King Class Scout]

problem is there are alot of ships out there..many do not have agreed upon specs in the first place. I balance all mine to galaxy class=1000 phaser damage which was p81's original replacement ship. Sov's are 1200-1400 usualy.
If/when I get around to finishing the tos pack I started it will come with a balance sheet where the standard constitution has 1000 phaser damg and 10000 shield points. ALl other tos ships are a percentage higher or lower. This of course means that you can't battle outside the era but really..the point of taking the tos ent against a cube is what exactly? Or a warbird? One barrage would kill it, if not one shot. We saw evidence for this when the TOS defiant in the NX era when against the NX enterprise and wasted it. The A would do roughly the same and, while there is less difference between the A and B as far as time the C would easily waste either and the D would waste either the A or B in just a few shots, assuming factory specs for each.

I've rebalanced the Catch Pack i'm working on to the P81 gal as well (which I keep getting told to dump and replace with someone elses)  unfortunately, i KNOW how people are when it comes to their designs and feelings of "copyright", as i come from another community that routinely deals with theft and wipe of copyright. 

there allready is a bit of a standard I've noticed with the TOS and TMP eras.  TOS phasers are usually set to an absolute max of 200 damage at a short distance, with TOSpedoes at 300.  this makes tosers ineffective against anything outside their own era, and even then, it's a tough fight. TMP phasers either are set to 150 or 300 damage, and the torps aren't much better.  i keep going back to the NXprise and variants, cause the Photonics will actually deal some damage

anything from the era ahead will do a one-shot kill on the previous era, and then there's the "super torpedo" types (the cardie hybrid) which will take you out instantly before you have a chance to fire. KM is rigged so that the opponents automatically switch to their most powerfull torps.

[X_TheUnknown_X]

This is a problem that has plagued game developers for years: this aspect of 'balancing' everything so the game runs smoothly (if you've ever played any Call of Duty multiplayer, I think you'll agree balancing the game is tricky).
The problem here is, standardising the weapons would cerntainly help to improve the game (ATM, the Sovereign seems to overpower all other ships), it still leaves the problem of the individual hardpoints. Deadthunder has already mentioned the issue with the Akira; the only way past that would be to give it low-damage torpedoes or remove the excess launchers. In my experience so far, when I've asked people to beta test mods, is that a ship can be balanced against some ships - but completely over/under-powered against others. I've always tried to slot my ships in with Kobayashi Maru, and use it's standards where possible.
This idea is excellent, but it will require much thought and testing in order to reach some kind of balance. I do hope you'll attempt this project, because a standardised set of weapons would be a welcome addition to the game.

[Nexxus21]

Welcome Back from the abyss Book
I think most people rework their hard points to make for a more balanced game which is what I do but a standardized weapon script would be on a Christmas wish list for me. The problem is it would really have to cross eras as well. It used to bug me that some vessels from a previous era had shield and weapon strength comparable to post era vessels and they were not refit vessels. In some cases number of torpedo tubes, max number of torpedoes, or reload delay needed tweaking as well as max damage distance, discharge rate or maximum damage delivered by phasers. In a nutshell a uniform standardization would be nice but applying them to the numerous vessels across multiple eras with individual HP's would be tedious at best with the exception being ship packs that use a primary HP. Anyone up for a challenge  

[Lurok91]

I note several people have commented on putting a TOS vessel up against a later era, which is something I'd never dream of      And yes, even a standardised Akira would still be a heavy hitter, but if the torpedo fire rate and shields/hull was made more 'realistic'  it's not unbeatable.