Author Topic: The Precise Defiant (Read 9774 times)

ACES_HIGH · « **Reply #40 on:** April 04, 2011, 06:07:31 PM »

it looks like the outer hull starts to angle down aft of the bridge centerline. It's worth noting that this complies with the original internal arrangement as depicted in the DS9TM, since deck one would gradually lose clearance towards the stern, a two deck high space (such as engineering) would take the most advantage of this area without having to compensate for a lower ceiling.

Saquist · « **Reply #41 on:** April 07, 2011, 04:38:57 AM »

Indeed.
I've highlighted the portion of the Aft part of the circle seems to follow the the rest of aft Deck One in a rudimentary surface model.
(The Green potion)

Of course the illusion is that from the perspective views there is no discernble declination of the circle or the rear Deck One but from the Ortho there is a 1 degree angle. Notice though the black (or shaded gray) shows the perfectly top areas. I wonder if the outer perimieter of the outer most gray ring doesn't follow the angle as well. I but it does...that area looks particularly smooth not angular.

Saquist · « **Reply #42 on:** April 24, 2011, 06:40:33 AM »

The Lakota DVD proved extremely difficult to pin down so I shifted to First Contact Damaged Defiant view of the model produced and finished the first detailed version of the Defiant's Top Ortho.

I was able to narrow down some fine detail on the phaser canon, some of the trim at the rear and color coded the drawing blue for external form lines and black for detail lines. I also added the fine detail on the nose that was seen in one little ship.

This is only version 1 as I will continue the series for the remaining four orthos and then I'll make a final version base on the necessary corrections after all orthos are created.

Saquist · « **Reply #43 on:** April 28, 2011, 06:06:53 AM »

I thought whenI laid out the lines of the bottom rear section that I saw some sort of strange angle that differed from the rest of the flat bottom section. I hadn't seen that trace in so long I was beginning to wonder had I been seeing things.

But I did it again with a few trace drawings and found the perfect depiction of the up angle of the rear section.

So many things are falling into place after the top view it's almost laying itself out.
So far the is a good premilinary TOP, FRONT and a mostly complete Bottom View. But I can't imagine why they would angle this section. I really does cut out a bit of level format that most Federation ships have, it really must be engineering space.

Saquist · « **Reply #44 on:** April 30, 2011, 01:58:45 PM »

The Bottom view was more difficult to confirm and I'm not all that confident on the detail on the nacelles.
I was able to confirm above an incline on the bottom tail.
The Warp engines are flared as they meet the fuselage so while they look like the same width all the way from out board to in board they are not.
Not all detail is included on the nose sides seen from this angle. (felt at this moment with no side view I can't have get close to accurate)
The curvature of the inner forward section along the flat bottom is directly traced from an underview of an unfinished Defiant model so I know it's right, however I'm not sure how well I've matched the subsquent curves progressing outward toward the torpedo launchers because where they meet the nose looks a little to sharp. I'll see If I can address that in the next version.

Next is the side view

Nebula · « **Reply #45 on:** April 30, 2011, 04:06:16 PM »

hmm interesting. are ya still using those imgs I gave?

Saquist · « **Reply #46 on:** May 01, 2011, 02:58:39 PM »

Most definitely. They've been invaluable up to this point but the underside isn't one of the well photographed portions so I may have to lean on the Fact files, Davide Schmidts designs and what ever I can make out on the DVD's.

ACES_HIGH · « **Reply #47 on:** May 02, 2011, 12:47:08 AM »

they probably didn't shoot it much because I think that's where they usually attached it to the MoCo rig for filming.

Saquist · « **Reply #48 on:** May 02, 2011, 01:45:59 AM »

Which means I won't be able to discern from the model what that tech cluster looks like where it fired a tractor beam and launched a shuttle from.

ACES_HIGH · « **Reply #49 on:** May 02, 2011, 02:58:05 AM »

yeah, I can only think of a couple of shots where we see that part of the model, and I don't know if they are decent enough for your project, or even if they were done with the physical model.

Edit:
I did a quick search on trekcore, and I found a couple in the Defiant gallery, but I don't know if they'll do any good because I couldn't tell which model was used and they're all kinda odd angles:
http://trekcore.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=6&page=1

eclipse74569 · « **Reply #50 on:** May 02, 2011, 01:51:19 PM »

Well the one with the tractor beam on the Runabout is definitely the CG version...I remember that because we see her exiting Warp in the system (And I don't mean the old Next Gen way of showing the starfield turning to normal). IIRC They only used CG for those shots.

EDIT: THe others I'm with you on that one, I can't tell whether they're CG or studio model.

Saquist · « **Reply #51 on:** May 05, 2011, 05:26:17 AM »

Quote from: ACES_HIGH on May 02, 2011, 02:58:05 AM

yeah, I can only think of a couple of shots where we see that part of the model, and I don't know if they are decent enough for your project, or even if they were done with the physical model.

Edit:
I did a quick search on trekcore, and I found a couple in the Defiant gallery, but I don't know if they'll do any good because I couldn't tell which model was used and they're all kinda odd angles:
http://trekcore.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=6&page=1

Yeah, looks like the Star Trek Fact files defiant didn't even bother with the tech cluster either (shocker)
and all of my model shots have a pole though it. The best shots I have are fuzzy like some of these. I'm just going to have to "fudge" it.

The Side view is going to take some time. Looks like not one got it right.
I'm using the inside of indention for the nose to figure out the true profile of the ship shoulder section between the Nose and the Bridge.
It doesn't seem to be as thick as everyone is depicting it.

kitkat27 · « **Reply #52 on:** May 26, 2011, 12:30:08 AM »

Hey Saquist,
I found a link that shows a bunch of studio model shots. If you already have it then my apologies.
http://starshipmodeler.com/trek/ds9tech.htm
^scroll down to the Defiant's section and there's like 20 pictures with some quite obscure angles.

Saquist · « **Reply #53 on:** May 27, 2011, 05:35:38 AM »

Indeed I do have them. But I appreciate it anyway.

~I'm taking a little time to learn Solidworks to help for the side view since it's more intuitive than AutoCAD. If I make a mistake with Solidworks I can make edits to solid model and work with dimension. AutoCAD is too final. I'm trying to determine if the front "shoulders" (the section between the nose the nacelles) slopes down from underneath or is is straight. There are no true side views so I'm going to attempt to match what I see in the perspective views we have.

May take time.

Saquist · « **Reply #54 on:** June 17, 2011, 07:56:52 AM »

Sorry for the delay on the project.
Work interferes with Hobby...

This week I was finally able to find a reliable solve for the height of Defiant's Primary Fuselage. Thanks to Google Sketch Up's photo match I was able very accurately plot the nose slot and gather some useful numbers that I immediately dumped into CAD. The results were very, very satisfying. After I rescaled the findings to my drawings I found my "guestimations" were really close but not quite. Moving lines to sync up with the new parameters lead to very close approximation of Defiant's side view. (not necessarily the nose though) which is another project in-itself)

I had hoped the DVD's would give me the forward view data I needed but it turns out the Photos are a far better resource. This near completion of the side view turns out to be good work-around for the height data. My hope is within 2-3 weeks I might finish the side front and aft views of Versioin One and begin the fine tuning process.

Saquist · « **Reply #55 on:** June 20, 2011, 04:26:21 AM »

This the Sketch Up phot match.
This photo displayed some interesting perpendiculars that were useful in determining the goings-on within the Nose Notch.

It's still a guestimation on the vanishing points but this was extremely close to what was neeed.

It determins the shape of not just the nose notch but the Height and position of it's ventral section that will sweep back as the shoulders of the ship.

The magenta sectioin circled in green is the plugged-in varriables measured from Sketchup and they fit in perfectly wants scaled to the back and front of the notch. So the magenta lines are what you would call "a sure thing" I feel more comfortable extrapolating heights by eyeballing it from here with this established information. I doubt I would be able to continue to match the image but now I can work on some of the other heights as the shoulders flow to the nacelles.

FarShot · « **Reply #56 on:** June 20, 2011, 11:39:42 AM »

Excellent job, Saquist! I may not reply to every post, but I'm watching like a hawk.

DJ Curtis · « **Reply #57 on:** June 21, 2011, 03:12:13 PM »

As am I. This is turning out to be a fantastic project.

Morgan · « **Reply #58 on:** June 24, 2011, 01:18:55 PM »

A project like this definitely shows the dedication this community has to BC and Trek as a whole. Well done, Saquist.

Saquist · « **Reply #59 on:** June 27, 2011, 04:56:12 AM »

Frankly, the Defiant deserves it...and so do the fans. Thanks gentleman.

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

This is a preliminary Port view with no detail just the major contours.
Not much remains of David Schmidt's interpretation in this view. Most of the black is his, like the nacelle outline. I've confirmed most of that interpretation is right with a slight dip at the front of the nacelle as it's higher rear end slopes down to the primary hull. FOR RIGHT NOW the Deflector is also his.

(NOTE: I used to draw portraits back in high school and after graduation and I noticed the easiest way to capture a persons essence is by every little detail. You just never know what understanding a small wrinkle around the nose will have once you start to draw the corners of the mouth...so add it. So if anyone is wondering why I'm adding the detail within the nose cove, it's because it's a detail that will be relevant as I figure out the nose)

The nose Deflector is tricky and it's now essentially the last part to be measured as I'm about 94% sure of everything else. In Schimidt's version the nose kinda hangs low, slightly peaking about the primary hull. But I'm looking at some side views which I will post later that imply that it sits higher...and perhaps just coincidentally some of the detail in the photos from the underside show the nose either a bit thinner or as said before...higher in the cover than Schmidt shows. You'll see a double line on the top of the nose too...I have decided if my interpretation or Schmidt's is right. There will be a struggle with finding the FULL and COMPLETE shape of the nose deflector as the rear part that joins to the primary hull has never been seen so I'm going to give it my best considering all the pictures.

The side view shows somethings we've been over.
The slope of the command deck as it falls to the rear.
The rise of the bottom as it goes aft (red horizontal line)
Haven't gotten to interpreting the port to starboard arc on the back of the command deck though

Currently the focus is the nose.

News:

Author Topic: The Precise Defiant (Read 9774 times)